kRemtronicz New Look - Your Initial Reaction?

[kremo5le]

Our New Look - Your Initial Reaction?

Hey guys,

We have re-done our site. It is not 100% done but the structure is. We wanted to let people know about our new services, as the old site didn't have them, and thus why we launched it incomplete. To your eyes might look finished, but it is just a temporary illusion to get the rest of the pages done. For example, the home page is not what we want. Specifically the middle area.

Thinking in terms of not only design but simplicity and user friendliness, what do you think?

THANK YOU for your input!

 

[ronaldroe]

Design-wise, I like it. From a code standpoint, it could use a little work. You pretty much went div crazy. Try to reduce the number of elements to the least amount necessary. Also, make sure you're calling alternative fonts in case your custom fonts don't work.

Well, that's what I was going to say, but then I realized you're just using a template. Is that what you do for your clients? Sell them "web design", and just download someone else's work, and crappily coded work at that, and claim it as your own?

 

[Phreaddee]

looks like just another wordpress template....

specifically. it looks like this.
http://www.yootheme.com/demo/wordpress/vanilla

word of advice. people on these forums aren't too kind to folk who just rip off templates and "claim" them as their own design. particularly when there are actually designers here who develop their own ideas from scratch and then offer them up for critique.

you? - you're just wasting our time...

 

[kremo5le]

I wasn't claiming that we did the design; I only wanted an opinion on the look and functionality of the site: you misunderstood the question. What we do on our side is our problem, but now you ask, here's what we do:

We offer packages for ALL sorts of clients: from custom designed websites to template-based websites: it all depends on the client's need. We are currently working on what you defend so much "100% custom sites" which are not better or worse than using templates, once again, depending on the client. We have customized several CMS templates, created several from PSDs (as we ALWAYS do for ALL our clients who pay for custom design) and also worked on websites that are 100% from scratch. Our website projects are about 30% template, the rest is custom.

In our case, we chose to use a template which we liked so we could focus on the important aspects of our site. We are also working on validating the code: the proof. Not all pages pass, for now, but we are working on it. DIVs or no DIVs, we are taking the steps to validate.

Thank you for your input anyhow: an opinion is an opinion. I hope you respect our business as much as we respect yours.

 

[ronaldroe]

I love it when they respond.

Know what's funny? Your own website is part of the "30% template". What does that say about an organization that supposedly provides web "design" services? It says to me that you're either too lazy or too incompetent to design your own site.

The fact is, either you actually believe that it's OK to take people's money to rip off someone else's work, which means you're retarded, or you got caught with your pants down, and you're trying to play it off like it was on purpose.

Be honest. What does it say about your business if you can't even be bothered to do the work on your own site? It just makes it seem like you either don't care, or you are just trying to throw something together to make a quick buck. Will customers notice? Not likely. Still, certain principles should be adhered to in order to lend credit to a profession.

 

[kremo5le]

You talk like you are the design God or something. lol. Should I bow to you now? Rose petals as you stroll down the beach as well? Come on dude... If this is your attitude towards a simple post, I can only imagine how you react towards your clients. Now THAT says a lot about who you are and how you behave. Had a bad day or something? Geesh!

You don't know what we are capable of. Now It sounds to me like you are one of those who rejects CMS because you just don't understand the capabilities they offer.

Anyhow, I respect your point of view and wish you the best. No hard feelings on this end. We are just talking, right?

 

[Phreaddee]

created several from PSDs (as we ALWAYS do for ALL our clients who pay for custom design)

thats a shame, always from psd's is possibly a bit limiting dont you think. lets hope you dont slice them.

You don't know what we are capable of

PSD>html and 30% templated "design"

 

[kremo5le]

Not quite, but almost:

PSD > CMS (Joomla!, Wordpress, or Drupal) - 30% Templates which we end up customizing no matter what.

 

[ronaldroe]

I can only imagine how you react towards your clients.

I'm quite courteous to my clients. I also provide them a quality product that I created. I just don't take well to people who devalue an entire industry just because they want to take the easy way out.

Now It sounds to me like you are one of those who rejects CMS because you just don't understand the capabilities they offer.

Way off on that one. Quite the opposite.

 

[jumpingspider]

It seems like there's a tension here! Reading your responds I would say all of you have the point, Thus kremo5le,you should take their opinions because you asked their opinions or should I say our opinions about your site! They didn't just get it somewhere,believe me they know what they are talking about!

 

[kremo5le]

It seems like there's a tension here! Reading your responds I would say all of you have the point, Thus kremo5le,you should take their opinions because you asked their opinions or should I say our opinions about your site! They didn't just get it somewhere,believe me they know what they are talking about!

Some people just blow things out of proportions without thinking first. Basically, we were stereotyped. Using a template does not make you inferior or anything. Specially when it has been heavily modified to suit our needs. We DO create sites from scratch too, I have been saying that all along. Some clients can't pay for custom work so we have the "template package." NOTHING wrong with that and that is not changing neither: the demand is out there. Heck, some pre-made templates look light years better than a custom site.

I mentioned that I do respect their opinion but... we do custom websites too! If a client wants a template package then they know, explicitly, they are getting it. It is on our web design pages in any case. Most people, however, don't want that, and we are happy to do that because that's were the creative part kicks in.

It was just the tone and hatred of the initial posts without even digging a little bit into what we do or who we are or how we treat our clients. But, that's how the world is and I'm not taking anything personal.

Thanks for you input!

 

[Phreaddee]

See there you go again

Specially when it been modified heavily to suit our needs

You havent changed shit. A different font, different copy and a different header image
If thats how much you modify them for your customers than **** me!
You are deluded...

 

[ronaldroe]

It was just the tone and hatred of the initial posts without even digging a little bit into what we do or who we are or how we treat our clients.

Do you really think you're the first to come on here and do this? We knew what you were from the get-go. You have the same attitude as these knuckleheads who think it's OK to grab the latest version of Xara or whatever craptastic WYSIWYG editor they can find (not suggesting you do that particularly) and drag and drop some piece of garbage together and call it good. It's the easy road. The customer won't know, right?

You honestly don't need to modify someone else's work, which may have legal or ethical issues attached, to quickly put together sites for people on the cheap. And because I've griped without presenting a better solution, here you go:
There are CSS frameworks. It's a little outdated and there are better ones, but give 960gs a look. Search around and find one that works for you. There are many of them. Some are more robust than others. Some are designed for huge complicated layouts, while others are more for simple ones.
There are boilerplates. There's a fantastic boilerplate for Wordpress called Bones. The developer refers to it as a theme, but it's really more of a boilerplate. There's also the HTML5 Boilerplate. Another great one.
And after all that, you can also sit down and just write your own template, or framework or boilerplate. What do you think I do when I need a site fast and on the cheap? I have a kit that I built that has most of the HTML and all of the structural CSS already in place. And everything's already split up into PHP files. It's far from a template, though. It's my own little boilerplate for rapid design.

 

[kremo5le]

There are CSS frameworks. It's a little outdated and there are better ones, but give 960gs a look. Search around and find one that works for you. There are many of them. Some are more robust than others. Some are designed for huge complicated layouts, while others are more for simple ones.
There are boilerplates. There's a fantastic boilerplate for Wordpress called Bones. The developer refers to it as a theme, but it's really more of a boilerplate. There's also the HTML5 Boilerplate. Another great one.
And after all that, you can also sit down and just write your own template, or framework or boilerplate. What do you think I do when I need a site fast and on the cheap? I have a kit that I built that has most of the HTML and all of the structural CSS already in place. And everything's already split up into PHP files. It's far from a template, though. It's my own little boilerplate for rapid design.

Hey, thank you very much for the help. We do really want to provide as much custom work as possible.

FINAL THOUGHT

I like in to ask to be helped. This conversation has been really good but the hatred part was just not necessary. That is not how people who use templates will learn how to do 100% custom work. That is how people who use templates will not like guys like you and end up doing it even more. But that's not us. In life we need to leave our hate on the side, sit down, and talk. I am an open, understanding person, but not when I am, literally, attacked. That is primitive, childish, non-constructive behavior and I could have just "walked away."

We provide a hell of a job and our clients are all happy, satisfied, and getting what they pay for, custom 100% or with a template. Again, the demand is out there and some clients just can't and/or don't care to afford custom work (30%).

Thank you.

 

[ronaldroe]

FINAL THOUGHT

I like in to ask to be helped. This conversation has been really good but the hatred part was just not necessary

In life we need to leave our hate on the side, sit down, and talk. I am an open, understanding person, but not when I am, literally, attacked. That is primitive, childish, non-constructive behavior and I could have just "walked away.".

Disagreement isn't hate. The sooner people learn that, the quicker people will learn to just listen. Righteous indignation and political correctness for the sake of not hurting someone's feelings are more detrimental to a society than actual hate will ever be.

 

[kremo5le]

Then I thank you for teaching me something new. Typing stuff on an email or forum can lead to misinterpretation sometimes.

Good luck to you! :O)

 

[anna]

Disagreement isn't hate. The sooner people learn that, the quicker people will learn to just listen. Righteous indignation and political correctness for the sake of not hurting someone's feelings are more detrimental to a society than actual hate will ever be.

Nail. Head. Love love love it...

 

[Brian Angel]

Then I thank you for teaching me something new. Typing stuff on an email or forum can lead to misinterpretation sometimes.

Good luck to you! :O)

The only misintepretation here is you as a web designer. Do something original, the rest has all been said.